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Wednesday, November 26, 2008

No Doctors in Countries with Socialized Medicine? Data, Please....

Oh look! Some early turkey in my inbox! ;-)

"Ronald S. Bank, M.D." sends me an e-mail with nothing but the following subject line: "Good luck trying to find MDs willing to work for nothing in single payer."

Right, Dr. Ron. Our glorious market-based health care system is why the United States ranks 42nd worldwide in physicians per capita, ahead of those godless socialists in Canada, but behind Denmark, Ukraine, Norway, the Netherlands, Sweden, Spain, Germany, France, Portugal, Israel, and even Cuba, all of which I suspect have some sort of nationalized health coverage.

So, Dr. Ron, when Obama and Daschle get done reforming health care, be sure to send me a postcard from your new office in Zimbabwe.


  1. I suspect that Obama and Daschle will have to fight a long, bitter, ferocious war for their cause, especially if they have comprehensive reform in mind. They may well lose that war to the special interests. But really, nothing short of total reform will do any good. Whether or not they can "pull it off" may depend in large measure on exactly how they propose to pay for it.

  2. Look, as a taxpayer, I wouldn't mind contributing to some sort of fund or program to help people get health insurance. But I don't want any kind of mandates. I am self-employed and pay my own health insurance. It is not easy but I just have to set priorities. So I want what I pay for...to see a doctor whenever I want to, and not have to wait until it is too late for a test or operation.

  3. CA, once again YOU ARE WRONG.

    "Doctors' strikes have become a commonplace occurrence outside the US. A few weeks ago, French doctors briefly went on strike to protest the low price fixed by the government for consultations, as well as limits on the working hours (and therefore the wages) of hospital personnel. In Croatia, doctors have just ended a month-long strike to protest low salaries offered by that country's nationalized medical service. At a major hospital in New Zealand, senior doctors have struck one day a week for the past three weeks and plan to keep doing so for another three weeks, also in protest against low government salaries.

    In Nigeria, doctors have gone on strike to protest the government's failure to pay a promised wage increase, while doctors in Ghana are striking for better working conditions at state-run hospitals.

    All of the overseas doctors are striking against socialized medical systems in which doctors' fees and work procedures are set, in minute detail, by the government. When the government is short on money or wants more services, its first step is always to squeeze the doctors—restricting their fees, regulating their services, or just plain refusing to pay them. The doctors are left with only one recourse: to go on strike." (Ayn Rand Center for Individual Rights)

    HALF of Adelaide's emergency room specialists have handed in their resignation after the South Australian Government refused to meet their wage demands.

    In two weeks, 44 doctors are expected to walk away from their jobs at metropolitan hospitals, eight months into pay negotiations. (The Australian, June 13, 2008)

    In the past few months, hordes of white-coated doctors have made regular - and noisy - appearances on the streets of German big cities.
    More than 12,000 employees of university and state hospitals in nine German states have protested long hours and pay levels far below that of their colleagues in the rest of Europe. (CSM, June 7, 2006)

    There is a problem in Bulgaria, which belongs to the so-called public secrets - everyone knows but nobody talks about it. This phenomenon is the health care system with all its disadvantages that unfortunately are much more than the advantages.

    There are numerous examples of doctors, who neglect their duties and do not assist the needy. The medics often refuse to examine patients because they cannot afford to give money for bribing. No matter the doctors call it "a gift in acknowledgement of the service". (Noinvite.com, June 2008)

    Need more "DATA PLEASE"??

    EVERYWHERE that socialized medicine has been attempted, it has or is failing. It doesn't work.

    The UK is the best example of failure, with their system that was introduced "at a cost to the taxpayer of 1-3 million pounds" and ending up at a whopping 23-30 million pounds.

    By all means, let's follow the example set by the very countries that you so ignorantly commented on.

    Maybe WE can cross the border into Mexico for treatment the way approximately 1/2 to 3/4 million Canadians do to us each year.

    Enjoy that turkey :)

  4. What does doctors per capita have to do with the quality of healthcare? Or...What is your point?

    Let's say a doctor kills all his patients. So, Now there is one doctor for every person in that country!

    Cory, Ha! You are a HOOT!

  5. So, actually fewer doctors per capita would mean a better healthcare system, in a first world country!

    You just CAN'T get it! That is both incredibly funny and sad at the same time.

  6. One last thing, the majority of those countries Death Rate is much higher than the United States!


    A Governmental One-Payer(Nationalized Healthcare) system hasn't worked! It will work in the United States as well as the Bailouts have. If anything should tell you how the government handles important issues it should be the bailouts, headed up by Democrat Politicians and Policies!

  7. The link you post for data on Physicians per capita for the US is only 8 years old, and even older for several of the countries listed in the study. Is this the best you can do?

  8. "Dr. Ron" claimed I would have trouble finding a doctor to work for nothing under single payer. My point, very simply, is that "Dr. Ron's" comment is complete bull, as there appear to be more doctors available in countries with single payer or other national health coverage systems than there are in the United States. Besides, doctors overseas aren't working for nothing. As for quality, well, heck, folks are living longer in other countries....

  9. As for updated data, well, if anyone else would like to take a turkey break and find me some 2008 numbers, I would welcome the assistance!

  10. I'd like to see testimonials from people who have had experiences on both sides of the issue, to wit:

    (1) People who have left the U.S. to get medical care they could not afford or qualify for here, and

    (2) People who have come to the U.S. to get medical care they could not obtain at a satisfactory level in their home country.

  11. I have a second cousin who attended a semester of college in London a few years ago. One night he developed severe stomach pains and his room mates took him to the emergency room. When he got there he asked what it was going to cost and was told not to worry about it. He ended up having two doctors checking him over at the same time, it ended up he had eaten something that wasn't right or something like that. he never received a bill, nor did his parents, or their insurance company. He was told that if he had been admitted or needed follow up there would have been a bill, but he was real satisfied with the prompt service and care that he received.


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